sorry buddy people have finally woke up from their 20 year slumber.. .....The public takers better get used this new change QUICKLY !!

PS you cant lose your house for not paying a garbage bill you cant afford, but you will lose your house for not paying a property tax bill you cant afford

I agree - just as sewer fees are not deductible, now trash collection will not be.

Not short-sighted at all... If anything, knee-jerk property tax increase as the only solution is short-sighted. Where does it end? The threatened increase in user-fees was a scare tactic to get voters to approve the referendum. I want Lawrence to be what Lawrence was.......

the sunwill come up in the morning and the message will be understood by all

Nothing good . . .

Wahoo, if you live in Brick, why do you spend so much time on the site. you clearly don't understand what I am asking here...

lets just say i spent many days in Lawrenceville......but mostly i will post anywhere that thinks they can continue the theft of property taxes to be pay for the croynism and back room deals of the past 20 years.......ITS OVER !

you just don't get it- we decided to buy homes here because it WAS affordable compared to some other towns close by. We don't want to pay as much as other towns. We want and know it's possible to remain an affordable town for families to live. Keeping this town affordable will only help sell homes and attract residents to move here which will help the local economy. WAKE UP!!!!

Oh great lawrence taxes are lower than other towns. We should vote "yes" to the budget so we can get even more ripped off why not other towns are doing it.

So is this your brilliant idea? I don't want to pay the tax so I'll push it on to someone else, preferably someone who doesn't have a vote like the parent of a student at Rider University.

Private colleges are exempt from NJ property taxes under state law 54:4-3.6. See: http://law.onecle.com/new-jersey/54-taxation/4-3.6.html

So this would require a change to the state law.

There are more than 2,000 resident students at Rider that could register to vote in your school district. They might swing the vote if they found out that their tuition was going to go up because you wanted to pass a budget that taxed Rider.

I was unaware they are exempt by state law . The issue is coming up with a idea how to fix the mess. If there were minimal waste in our budget I would have no problem voting for the increase to keep services and so no one gets layed off. but believe me when i say i know alot of people in lawrence and am on multiple commitees and I hear about the ridiculous waste in spending from friends who work for the township and I have seen it first hand. If they raised Riders tuition 17% because of bad decisions you would be angry and i would not blame you.

The township isn't after the schools to pay taxes, he is after the residents at Lawrenceville School who live in houses on campus that are considered tax exempt. They are not temporary homes like dorms nor for students. They are homes that just happen to be on campus, and receive the full benefits of living in the township tax free. There is a document detailing this on the township web site.

I agree with you 100% ! It's about time citizens of Lawrence wake up and, pay attention to who is burning your hard earned money. None of these politicians should be voted back in. This is where we gain our power. Also, there is not enough voter turn out, during election, we should encourage everybody we know to vote out all these losers. They need to balance the budget just like the rest of us are doing at home. If you don't have the money you don't keep spending. The furloughs worked for the state, I suggest that and, no raises for the next few years. They better not take away the little $200 tax discount for veterans or seniors. Politicians always balance their budget on the backs of the poor. Well, it better not happen here in Lawrence, we will protest loudly. As far as the school budget not passing I say....Yeah! You would not believe how much waste goes on in our Lawrence school system. Folks are fooled into thinking that raising school taxes goes toward better education....News Flash to you all "NO IT DOESN'T". THE KIDS NEVER SEE A DIME TOWARD EDUCATION..... Wake up people, these is a property reassessment coming, why would we just keep handing over our money to the township when our taxes will be so sky high next year, watch for all the for sale signs appear in your neighborhood.

Anybody remember that commercial where the man in the suit behind the desk exultantly proclaims, "I really stuck it to the man!" ?? His underling then says: "But sir, you ARE the MAN!

You're welcome.....I'm just happy my vote counted.

Let's see what happens with garbage collection...I say it was a scare tactic by the Township Mgr. and Council in an effort to get their referendum passed. If increased user fees is the "only solution" according to this council and Mgr., then we need to replace these people with more creative and fiscally conservative minds...

TPG, comment on my name if you like, but with a name like "TPG" you're not exactly specifying who you are either!

I CAN afford to live in Lawrenceville and I still voted NO. Why? Because I earned my money for myself and my family, not for politicians who created this mess, lied to us, and who have voted 5-0 that they would rather reward their employees than listen to their constituents, and even after 3 public meetings of backlash and a 2 to 1 vote against a tax increase they are still considering it

That's why I congratulate myself. For sticking to my principals and voting to keep my money, not turn it over to wasteful spenders.

If you're against these tactics, then you should come tell your council members. Tonight.

You are not getting the message here. This is all about principle. We as taxpayers will not be bullied. By giving in and, allowing this tax increase, the township will not learn it's lesson and, keep spending and, spending. They will assume that we will always cave into them and, keeping allowing them to live their same wasteful ways. This is all about our power as voters telling the folks at the township to stop abusing us ! They act like spoiled children and, it is time for them to grow up .....They could never get away with this behavior in a private business job. They would all be fired because they couldn't balance a check book.

Max, Now would a be good time to suggest cuts you keep talking about... remember, you can't void contracts... how about it?

They cannot find that kind of money. Now there may be some revenue that is under anticipated but that is how you regenerate the surplus that is applied this year. You have to be conservative with revenue because you are in big trouble if your projections fall short. The only way to cut the budget is through layoffs. The police cost the most money so you have to get rid of a good number of them. 21/2 million is a lot to cut. On another note, stinki is speaking of inflated raises. I think you will find that this isn't true. For example, the police contact was signed in 2010. The contact is 0 raise in 2010, 2.9% in 2011 and 2.9% in 2012. This was done prior to the 2% cap law. Now with that said, in 2010, the police started paying 1.5% of their salary for healthcare. In 2011, the state increased officers pension contribution another 1.5% of their salary. Last fall, instead of putting that money into the pension system, the governor refunded the amount to the township. Therefore, over 3 years, the police got a 5.8% raise however, the town received 3% of that money back. Therefore, the net raise for police has been less than 1 percent a year since 2010. Therefore, stinki, you really need to credit the givebacks to see the whole picture. Just giving some facts.

No, voted to keep his money that he worked for and not use it to line the pockets of the extortionists over on Rt. 206! Some people just don't get it!!

That's is Max who wrote the op ed and did the web site. He did not pay more. He lives in a 700k home. So this was a big win for him.

I agree with you concerned mom. My property taxes are significantly more than what you are paying in Lawrenceville (close to 40% more) but I am willing to pay it because high quality schools improve property values and a good education is worth every penny to my children. My school district is one of the best in the country and because of the excellent education my daughter received she won a scholarship that is worth nearly eight years of property taxes.

And you are right about the governor. The same thing is happening in NY. The governor reduces taxes by reducing aid to schools and then pats himself on the back for doing such a wonderful job of cutting taxes. All he is doing is moving more of the tax on to the middle class.

Thank you concerned mom. You actually get it.

Trenton has one of the highest tax rates in the state, so higher tax rates do not equate to a better town!!!

Read the front page story in the Trenton Times today at http://www.nj.com/times/pdf/thursday.pdf and listen to the audio that will be up on the Patch on Friday.

Not sure why but I know for a fact that Lawrenceville Gardens Apartments doesn't pay for garbage. How is this possible?

Stinki Garbage,
You are playing with numbers. Do you know how many people are getting this 1.3 million? Is it cops and fireman? groundskeepers? EMTs? People that save our lives every day? If there are 1300 of them that is a $1000 raise each, and insurance goes up every year. Many of them also have contracts that we are bound to so they were promised a certain increase. Do you really think that our township workers are "rich" people who sit on their asses and collect our tax money? Someone mentioned that if this were a business, the mayor would be fired. No, he would be able to use as much money as he wanted to take himself out to fine dining and write if off as a "business expense", fly to Vegas to impress a client on "business", and receive bonuses every year. There are few perks to being a public employee. The health insurance is all they have. I know you are all angry b/c you don't want to pay, but don't take it out on people's salaries. That is just wrong.

remember when you said it wouldn't be hard to cut 2.2 million? well, much of that money you quote is contracted. So you are either just naive and don't understand how public workers are paid, or just angry that public service workers in Lawrence can afford a 2009 Ford, and a week at the shore.
So what is it Max? and what do you want to cut that is not under contract.

Max, the more you ignore the reality the dumber you will look... Over that five years you love to quote, the average worker has had a $640 a year raise.... They have also given back overtime, health and pensions... so they take home less.

So today the average Lawrence public employee takes home LESS money then they did five years ago. Is that easy enough for you to understand?

Wahoo, do you understand this debate or are you just moaning yourself about your personal agenda... You don't add anything to this as an outsider, you don't understand the characters, the plot, or the theme. You heard a good beat that you can tap along with... time to jog on as the English say.

But, you don't. If you want cuts... so be it. Police will be fired. But don't pretend that the graph on that website of his tells you anything except he doesn't understand the budget or contracts.

I'm mad as well at council... But not for these baseless attacks on working people. Its the same attack you hear in PA, in Wisc. and from the state house.... sorry, but the guy pulling a 20 hour shift plowing the roads after a snow storm is not a THUG. That police officer, hardly a thug... and that teacher we also voted down... they are teaching our future... hardly a thug.

but they are easy. we pay them. and its nice to be able to fire someone. isn't it.

When it's all said and done, major layoffs will have to happen. Lawrence was never bloated with positions. When the cuts happen, the level of service will drop tremendously. It will be like Trenton. If you call for a cop, one will come but you might have to wait an hour or so like Trenton. Lawrence residents have always expected great service. If cuts are made, public works, ambulance and police services will change. Just remember not complain about it later.

Someone else had mentioned this, and it probably would not happen but the union contracts need to be re-negotiated. In the current economic climate they shouldn't be getting any raises. Many on here are whining about people losing their jobs, they don't have to lose them, they can just take a pay cut.
I'm sure they could save a million by cutting some salaries or just not giving pay increases.

You had to look at the first 2012 budget recommendation http://lawrencetwp.com/documents/manager/Documentsfor2012Budget/2012%20Budget%20Recommendation.pdf If you go to page 18 (page 26 of the PDF file) there is a table of organization. For example, the manager is 167000 for his manager duties (.5)then he gets another 20,500 (.5) for being in charge of finance for a total of 187500. There are two deputy tax assessor positions so you divide the amount 150000 by 2 or an average of 75000 per position. Hope this helps.

There are people who would rather cause people to lose their jobs than pay a couple of hundred dollars a year in taxes. There is a word for people like that.

So according to your logic, I better just keep working my tail off so that the people serving my community get a higher wage. It becomes very frustrating and difficult to get ahead financially when any increase you make, if any at all, gets taken away due to an increase in taxes.

If by paying a couple of hundred dollars a year more in taxes I can keep my neighbors employed, then yes, I will work my tail off to help my neighbors if that's what it takes. It's called being part of a community and caring about someone other than myself. You might want to try it. It makes you feel pretty good at the end of the day.

grill master, yes, it is hard to get ahead isn't it? Now picture being a public worker who is also getting the same tax raises as you are, being asked to pay more toward insurance, and everyone thinks you don't ever deserve a raise to cover it. And year after year you are asked to take pay freezes, and you do it, and everyone still hates you and thinks you deserve less. WE ARE ALL IN THE SAME BOAT! Stop blaming the public employees salaries for your financial woes. Trust me, they are suffering too!

Concerned Mom we are def taking a hit. We have had pay freezes, step raise freeze and have to pay more for health. Everyone wants to point fingers escpecially when they have NO clue what they are talking about!

No one is "blaming" the public employees. The council and manager, yes, they are being blamed for their poor planning and lack of foresight.

Yes we are all in the same boat, but what is your solution to get out this boat? Is it for us to pay more taxes? Yes, my family is paying more for health insurance this year too. But we bite the bullet and pay it, not go whine about not getting an increase in salary to cover it. So I really don't understand your point.

And as far as "thinking that everyone hates you and think you deserve less"...most likely you don't work in corporate America if you think that is not the case everywhere else.

Captains salary is already out of the budget. Lawrence is civil service, even the chief's position. They can be demoted but you cannot get rid of them by not renewing them. In civil service, you cannot force someone to retire. Just the facts.

Carter Road is County not Lawrence Public Works

The cop was probably on a side job. The company pays the town for the price of the cop and the car. The town actually makes a few bucks on this. It is not costing you anything. Just the facts.

My husband works for Public Works and they DO NOT do that road. Its a county road therefore the County takes care of that.

You are right they don't clean the roads everyday but they cut grass and keep the parks clean. Do you want our parks to look like Moody, I think not! Also by cutting all thoes jobs people will lose their homes, we def would, and I don't see how that is gonna help Lawrence Township when most of the employees live in Lawrence. My husband has been with the township 10 plus years and without his income we would have a home. My husband works very hard and so does his co-workers. Everybody is willing to cut the laboreres, the same people who work their asses off, and forget they have families too!!! How would like to lose your home because your job got cut?

what about the people in private sector, who lost their jobs and still are required to pay the property taxes to pay your husbands salary at the threat of losing their house if they do not or can not

Wahoo, what about them? Last month 11,000 private sector jobs where lost, the only thing offsetting that and keeping the unemployment rate in the great NJ recovery is the addition of over 3000 public sector jobs.

You have to look at this thing organically... as in you can't separate the parts to complete the sum. The public sector basically kept Lawrence from becoming Trenton. Many who live here, work for the state... This is a public sector community. I know Brick is tied to the military, and the beach, so I think you need a tad more context in your posts.

So even more people can collect unemployment and more people lose their homes...doesn't make sense to me!!!!

For your information I would get a job but my health is poor and I'm unable to work. So before you make judgements you "Let's Dance" should know all the facts!!!! And I'm not complaining he didn't get a raise I'm perfectly ok with that so AGAIN BACK OFF!!!!!!!!!!!!! You do not know all the details but wish to bash people...GROW UP!!!

Yes, I have small children in the school system too, which is why I voted YES to the school budget!!! I boggles my mind that there are actually people stupid enough that did not grasp the concept of the school budget and municipal budget being two separate items!!